|
Post by lord_denton on Jul 30, 2009 13:19:58 GMT -5
Its fine and dandy we are thinking up keywords. However, we still don't have a idea as to the theme of this Historical set. So, I'm going to first make this thread. You can drop any ideas of a theme for the set here. Please include Pros & Cons and Notes. After this has been up for a while, we'll choose the best ideas and make a poll for them. So, I shall start. Pirates: Return to the Barbary CoastNotes:-Would feature the return of the Coarsairs, plus America, Brittain, France and Spain. No regular Pirates. -This set would try and build on the power of the Coarsairs Pros:-"True" Pirating -Can build upon a pre-existing minor Nation, that is, by far, the most outdated of the minors (well, they do have "use Pirate crew" abilities) -Could allow for a new ship types( if styrene is used ): Bombs, Xebecs, Cons-Has already been done before -Some people would get whiney that the Pirates aren't in it. Pirates: Return to the South China SeasNotes:-Would include the Jade Rebellion( taking the form of the Asian countries of the time ), America, Brittain, Spain and France, for sure. Might include Pirates. If more room is needed, Pirates can be ousted -This would build on the Power of the Jade Rebellion Pros:-Can build on a pre-existing Minor nation -Can have some new ship types( if styrene is used ): Gunboats (like canoes), -The South China Seas is one of the rarest, and favorite, set of the Pirates community. It could solve the problem of the Jade Captains Cons:-People would get Whiney that Pirates aren't in there. And, if they are, it would crowd the set somewhat -Has already been done before Pirates: Return to the RevolutionNotes:-Would feature the Contintal Navy(America), Pirates/Privateers, Brittian, France & Spain -Although they were plenty of line of battles in the Revolution, there was also plenty of true Pirating, as well as Frigate battles (Which this game is better suited to) Pros:-Featured "true" Pirating (See above) -New ship types(if styrene is used): Schooners with Square sails, -No new/minor nation to build on, more space Cons:-Has already been done before
|
|
|
Post by admiralb on Jul 30, 2009 14:55:25 GMT -5
right now, I'm thinking we should stick with the regulars and don't do any minor factions unless the first set sells well and/or catches on...plus, by adding one of the minor factions in in place of the Cursed might annoy some people that really like the Cursed...you may find that hard to believe, but there are players that find the Cursed fu and interesting...its like playing Star Wars games as the Dark Side...who doesn't like that? Jones = Vader?! yeah, he's the biggest and baddest villain on the high seas and players like to think they're evil because they can't be in real life without serious consequences...
...anyway, of the ones you mentioned the Revolution Sequel is my choice...although I'd like to see the set more between the Revolution and the end of Napolean's reign...so early 19th century could be cool...an actual sequel chronologically to Revolution...Jean Lafitte could make a return...he needs a new persona to represent his ties to the War of 1812...hmm...
I still think an Age of Exploration set would be pretty cool...has easy English, Spanish, French stuff...also has easy in for new factions (Dutch and Portuguese if need be)...big name explorers that everyones recognizes that can bring in new gamers that may be unfamilar with the game...only down sides...America would probably not be included unless we stretch the time period quite far...Pirates wouldn't get as much representation as they probably deserve for a game named Pirates...and of course no truly large ships...even making 4-masters in an Age of Exploration set would almost be a stretch of the imagintation (the 4th mast would probably be decoration anyway, like the 4th mast on 4-mast galleys usually are)...there is the possiblity for Jade and Corsair in this set, but in limited amounts...think Xeng He for Jade...a new version of one of his contemporaries...Corsairs have a few that may work, but aren't terribly interesting...Piri Rais if I remember my own sets correctly...I altered his realy backstory a bit to fit the set, but he was based in reality (Corsairs represent the North Africa and Ottoman territories like the Jade represent Japan, Korean, and Southeast Asia)...you could even throw in Leif Ericson if you thought it'd work...the time period would be ridulously long, but there are possibilities...think about it...
|
|
|
Post by lord_denton on Jul 30, 2009 18:39:39 GMT -5
right now, I'm thinking we should stick with the regulars and don't do any minor factions unless the first set sells well and/or catches on...plus, by adding one of the minor factions in in place of the Cursed might annoy some people that really like the Cursed...you may find that hard to believe, but there are players that find the Cursed fu and interesting...its like playing Star Wars games as the Dark Side...who doesn't like that? Jones = Vader?! yeah, he's the biggest and baddest villain on the high seas and players like to think they're evil because they can't be in real life without serious consequences... Um, yeah. I'm actually one of those "crazy" people that think the Cursed are fun. But anyone who thinks that the Cursed has a place in a Historical set (unless we do real-life ghost ships) is wacko. I'll weigh on the rest latter.
|
|
|
Post by rustyhook on Jul 30, 2009 19:01:55 GMT -5
I think the age of exploration would be fun. I've done research on the English colony at Roanoke and its link to the Spanish Armada's invasion of England. I think that would be interesting to use the Spanish in a more warlike manner instead of their usual treasure seekers.
|
|
|
Post by admiralb on Jul 30, 2009 19:53:14 GMT -5
oooo...nice one rustyhook...hadn't thought of that tie-in...Roanoke...Sir Walter Raleigh and such...how did I forget about him?! haha!
I happen to like the Cursed too, but I can see the merits of historical sets...bring in some players that thought the game was all ghosts and steampunk and thought that wasn't very fun, for whatever reason...
...the Cursed are fun when you have some of the good stuff...no one likes using junky slow ships with bad cargo space...Jikiniki is fun in the right situation to mess with your enemy's head, but normally Cursed are about weird ways of totally overpowering the opponent...12pt Jones, Tsuro-type stuff, Celestine and her trade current voodoo, fog-hopping can be death when done correctly...
...yes, we need to do some more historical stuff...Decatur is a legend in our group for what I've done with him. Oddly enough, the European nations need more obviously historical pieces...since most American players can identify the historical American stuff pretty easily...I'd like more of that but for England, France, and Spain...are any of the Spanish crew in the game historical? if they are, I can't recall which...Alejandro Malaspina, any others...same for France...Nicolas-Tomas Baudin, but none others I can recall right now...plus look at them, they're both explorer types...maybe Spain and France need some historical captains or such...Cortez was a good example in another thread for a Spanish crew that is historical, big name, and would probably not be an explorer.
|
|
|
Post by vladsimpaler on Jul 30, 2009 20:05:19 GMT -5
I think the age of exploration would be fun. I've done research on the English colony at Roanoke and its link to the Spanish Armada's invasion of England. I think that would be interesting to use the Spanish in a more warlike manner instead of their usual treasure seekers. I concur, I heartily approve Rustyhook's suggestion. This could actually be an interesting set- we explore other sides of the nations, while still fitting the 'flavor' so to speak of the nations. admiralb- Yeah, Malaspina is the only historical crew for Spain. America has the most, then I think England, then Spain and then France. Pirates might be tied with England, or may be inbetween America and England.
|
|
|
Post by admiralb on Jul 30, 2009 21:41:10 GMT -5
hmm...the 4 in the F&S Con Ex pack, Lafitte, Benito DeSoto, was Diabolito? I could have sworn I heard he was real somewhere...umm...Shap'ng Tsai was, wasn't he? Wk just changed his story to fit their plans...Mysion is based on a real person...may be not exactly, but close...so what is that...8...8-1/2...if you count Mysion...haha...um...
America...Perry, Decatur, Preble, Eaton, JPJ, Haraden, Porter...right off the top of my head...7 so far...not sure about some of the minor characters like Wayne Nolan and such...I suppose its possible.
England...Myngs, Morgan, Cook, Woodes Rogers...not sure who else...probably a few smaller names I forgot.
...not like this really matters much anyway...so, clearly we need some more big names out there to attract the historical crowd...in the whole game there are what? 30 real historical characters...or there abouts...out of how many total characters...untold numbers...somewhere around 200...hmm...yeah, we need more real characters.
|
|
|
Post by lord_denton on Jul 30, 2009 21:56:58 GMT -5
Not to mention the "Historical" pieces aren't that Historical - Bonhomme Richard was a Up-Gunned East Indiaman, HMS Serapis was a Frigate, and I beleive they have but two of the six orginal US frigates in Five mast form (as they should be). Yeah, Age of exploration would be fun. Although, Pirates weren't in full force until things settled down abit (might be wrong on that), and, of course, the USA didn't exist. Gun duels only replaced the typical land-battles-on-ships until after the Armada. And, it would be criminal not to have Portugal in the game. Maybe, take up the space filled by the US's absence and the Pirates being less of a threat? I just read Vlad's post, and mine basicaly echoes it.
|
|
|
Post by omegatraf on Jul 30, 2009 22:23:18 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by lord_denton on Jul 30, 2009 22:31:46 GMT -5
just saying alot of work has been done. Sign up if you haven't already BTW Can't. Flightleader needs to approve new members, (being admin) and she doesn't pay attention anymore to her forums. Thats why I recruited old_man to post the fan-made set thread on there. I'll take a look at the thread soon.
|
|
cleverpun
Master & Commander
I need more wenches / More wenches and mead
Posts: 46
|
Post by cleverpun on Jul 31, 2009 2:31:57 GMT -5
How about a set focusing on multiple, smaller conflicts? Like a set about several countries Civil Wars' or something? Let me try and make a semi-decent proposal.
Pirates of Anarchy
Throughout the history of every country, there have been many conflicts which greatly affected the country in question, but didn't necessarily draw international involvement or attention. This set could focus on one such conflict for each nation.
Half of each of the ships in each nation could be part of each side of the conflict, meaning that they are still part of the greater nation, but also have a reason to participate in single-nation conflicts (meaning that a faction pack could still be a viable conflict by itself). Or each nation could could have it's own side in an inter-nation conflict.
Obviously not every single-nation conflict involved naval battles, but I have become attached to the idea.
Some potential conflicts (again, forgive the severe lack of naval involvement in some of them, but they may help spark ideas).
England: Wars of Scottish Independence, English Civil War
America: American Civil War, Mexican-American War
France: French Revolution (see a pattern yet?), French Wars of Religion, Thirty Years War, Hundred Years War(s)
Spain: War of Spanish Independence, Spanish Civil War.
Mercenary/Pirates: uhhh...
Pros: - Can explore other aspects and facets of the big nations. - Gives more creative room without dealing with a new (or smaller) faction.
Cons: - Obviously not all conflicts of these scales involved naval warfare, and in fact most didn't. - Depending on the conflicts chosen, none or few of them would be in the same time period (though I like the thought of a timeline of world history told through smaller conflicts...)
With a little more thought than I'm giving it, and a stronger knowledge of history than I have, this could be an interesting setting for the set.
|
|
|
Post by omegatraf on Jul 31, 2009 7:54:11 GMT -5
Can't. Flightleader needs to approve new members, (being admin) She had a full computer meltdown a while back and went quiet for a while. I have requested she update me with her current issues and hopefully get to the bottom of it.
|
|
|
Post by lord_denton on Jul 31, 2009 11:37:41 GMT -5
Can't. Flightleader needs to approve new members, (being admin) She had a full computer meltdown a while back and went quiet for a while. I have requested she update me with her current issues and hopefully get to the bottom of it. Well, she must of found time to update her blog.
|
|
|
Post by vladsimpaler on Jul 31, 2009 13:20:05 GMT -5
How about a set focusing on multiple, smaller conflicts? Like a set about several countries Civil Wars' or something? Let me try and make a semi-decent proposal. Pirates of AnarchyThroughout the history of every country, there have been many conflicts which greatly affected the country in question, but didn't necessarily draw international involvement or attention. This set could focus on one such conflict for each nation. I like the idea. Perhaps certain English ships could be hostile to eachother, etc. I don't like the idea of the American Civil War being in Pirates, and never have, but that's just my personal vendetta. The day ironclads are properly represented is when I'm going to call it a day. Not say that I think your idea is bad, which it isn't. @ Denton- I'm wary of Portugal because it's a bit too much like Spain. Sure, so are the Netherlands, but at least they have stuff like Fluyts. It's funny, when I designed the Dutch as a nation, they were very swarmy. Lots of really cheap ships, but not too good, and then big hulking treasure ships that took advantage of the chaos that the little ships created.
|
|
|
Post by cannonfury on Jul 31, 2009 20:33:08 GMT -5
why not have an age of trade set, like have clippers and steamships (not turbines) running the tea trade and other things like that
|
|