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Post by ding73ding on Sept 2, 2009 22:50:22 GMT -5
Ok... this is actually for YOUR benefits, believe it or not. I don't particularly plan to contribute. But let me tell you, you won't get anywhere without sorting up this "philosophical" point.
WHAT'S THE MAIN IDEA of your Player-made set?
To fill the void left by WK? That's not a mission statement. Anyway, WK was a profit-seeking company, you guys are not, so it's necessary that you have a different mission statement.
To create a set of new units that's 100% compatible with current Pirates code? What's new that's not already available in the 1000+ ships, and hundreds of additional units? Perhaps your plan is just to clone it so new players can buy them? That's ok, but somehow I feel this is not exciting enough for you.
To create a new expansion set with the theme of XXX? With XXX being something specific say: "Pirates in Space!" or "Steampunk Pirates" or "Pirates of Middle Earth" or whatever. That would be cool, but I also don't feel this is your direction.
Actually to some extent that's what WK was doing right? F&S went for turn-of-century techs, MI went for well... mystery islands...
Anyway my point is I haven't seen anyone explaining properly what is your core idea so my little contribution to you is: challenge you to come up with it.
Good luck!
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Post by vladsimpaler on Sept 2, 2009 23:15:25 GMT -5
Listen, Magic has over 10,000 UNIQUE cards and still, still the designers are coming out with new innovative abilities and cards. So we are trying to create new things for Pirates so that it doesn't get stale and so that people can find new ways to play. What is my personal goal? It's what I said above, plus I want to make things so that people will still be able to play the game that they enjoy playing, but I want to make it so that they look at it differently and have more choices in playing the cards that they want. Heck, in the design forum cards that I have made and other people have made have been play-tested a bit by me and I am surprised to find some hidden combo in the whole thing. Or a crew turns a ship that was sub-par into something that's actually pretty good. I don't want to fill the void left by WK, nor do I want to make one that's just compatible. I want to have the set have about 90% new abilities, with stuff like Captain and Helmsmen and Explorers making a comeback. For example, I made a a ship for England that made Musketeers into Marines. Suddenly Musketeers went from never used to actually pretty good. Stuff like that is what interests me. So what's the main idea? You're playing the same game, but I want it to be like 15th century Europeans finding out that the world isn't flat. Okay maybe not that extreme but you get the idea. Check out the design forum to get an idea of what I'm talking about. Not to put myself out there, but please check out this thread: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=design2&action=display&thread=72#5 and #1 would be of particular interest to you. I really want this game to be super customizable. Which is why printing blank ship deckplates and crew chits really appeals to me. Just use those rules, and some abilities, and stats and you're good to go! :edit: 200th post! ;D
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Post by marhawkman on Sept 3, 2009 9:08:04 GMT -5
#1: Support all factions equally. Last I counted there were 10 factions. the last set only used 7, and one of those(Mercenary) only had minimal support. As a MTG example it'd be like printing a set and not having any red cards.
#2: new stuff! Every pirates release has had something new in it. Not always something common, but something different and novel. (This is why I started the terrain thread)
#3: make things FUN! The game sucks if there's only 2-3 ships that anyone actually uses. Balance things so that you never know what someone will bring to the table in constructed events.
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Post by ding73ding on Sept 3, 2009 9:54:55 GMT -5
10 fractions? Ok Pirates, Cursed, Eng, Am, Fr, Sp, Jade, ehh... that's 7. Oh Merc, that's 8 (honestly what's merc?) Ahhh Vikings, I'm still missing one. Natives??? This is discussion about the original game, I'm taking this over to MT, you guys stick to your development here.
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Post by lord_denton on Sept 3, 2009 11:20:42 GMT -5
Okay, not aiming at anyone in particualar(actually that is sort of a lie, its mostly repeat offenders), but stop with the off-topic comments! You guys keep distracting every topic with either design talk that goes in the design forum, how many factions are in the game etc.
This stuff is important! And if people don't respond talking about the OP (orginal post[er]) I am going to start deleting posts.[/b]
Now...
I want to somehow find a way to distract the community with a project, so there is alot less "drifters" away from the game. Theme-wise, I want there to be a general "conscicous" of what the fans want. I want there to be as much unity as possible, through some compromising.
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Post by vladsimpaler on Sept 3, 2009 11:30:51 GMT -5
Honestly, my mission statement had nothing to do with design, however I just wanted to show ding73ding what is possible.
If this took the thread off-topic then I apologize.
In any case, @ ding73ding, did I provide you with a good enough mission statement?
That of, "Same game, but you are able to make it your game" could work.
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Post by lord_denton on Sept 3, 2009 11:34:10 GMT -5
Honestly, my mission statement had nothing to do with design, however I just wanted to show ding73ding what is possible. If this took the thread off-topic then I apologize. Actually I was talking about the "what say you thread", where there was talk of the board game campaign game that killed the thread(atleast to what it was meant for).
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Post by admiralb on Sept 3, 2009 15:11:44 GMT -5
sorry, if I had anything to do with killing that...I was trying to point out something had been done that was similar to the idea...and since there were replies to it that wanted further info and that thread was the only location I knew to reply I posted there...but anyway...
I think we've covered most of the goals here...filling some holes...the glaring ones more probable than say giving England another Captain, Helmsman combo crew. Get some new abilities out there to make older, less useful ships useful again (or for the first time). Keep the community enthused about the game and thinking about the game so it has a chance of coming back when a new company decides to pick up the rights to the game.
New ships designs/types is not necessarily a high priority to me.
...Barbary Corsair is the last faction ding73ding...
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Post by ding73ding on Sept 3, 2009 15:31:57 GMT -5
I'm certainly aware of the possibility, chasing Magik's 10,000 mark. It's not a direction I like, but we've long established that fact "Same game, but you are able to make it your game" is clear enough for me, but I am the last one you want to win over, now see if the other guys can get behind it.
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Post by ding73ding on Sept 3, 2009 15:52:41 GMT -5
LOL I saw what's happening to "what say you" thread and tried my best to unkill it. The problem is not that I am here to disrupt things. It's that your situation is so fragile. This thread is exactly here to help you to focus.
What happened to the "what say you" thread is exactly the result of the lack of a commonly-agreed mission statement or quote "a general "conscicous" of what the fans want" unquote. Really? I don't think anyone can explain what's this general consciousness of what the fans want.
IMHO, the "fans" already have what they need, even a complete newbie like me collected about 200 units (almost 100 ships) with an investment of under $50. So new fans aren't suffering much from WK's demise (rather the opposite really).
Anyway I do wish you well, believe it or not. Don't blame me for exposing issues or problems that just seem too obvious to me.
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Post by lord_denton on Sept 3, 2009 18:41:12 GMT -5
The problem is not that I am here to disrupt things. It's that your situation is so fragile. This thread is exactly here to help you to focus. Most of the people here have no opinion, they just want to continue the bluddy game with more pieces. This whole game revolves around new pieces every now and then. Why do you keep taking potshots at me with things I say? Is it because I'm viewed as the authority figurehead of this project, who's point of view and ideas are God? I'm a person of the people, I want this project to be what the fans want. Thats because we have not asked! We do not want ask until we know what we can do! We perform polls to see what they want, such as this: www.miniaturetrading.com/im/forum/viewtopic/t=4647///This: www.miniaturetrading.com/im/forum/viewtopic/t=4639///This: www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=730185This: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=6This: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=15This: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=20This: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=24And, this: custompirate.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=2Thats not the point. They are bored with the bones they have been thrown because they are all chewed up over the years. Not even to mention the last 5 releases are quiet un-comparable to the sets released in the first two years (2004, I believe). Yeah, they are. They don't want to play a dead game. A fan made set shows some life in the form of a active community. Who is you? Me? Its us. Things are sloopy, sure. They aren't problems, though. We purposefully work around for the time being, we don't know what we are doing as far as production. But, I think we are just going to forget about that and start polling (again). EDIT:
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Post by admiralb on Sept 3, 2009 21:04:50 GMT -5
thanks for that l_d...I think once we figure out how we're going to produce, pay for, and distribute this then we'll get our act together...until then I'll enjoy the ride.
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Post by ding73ding on Sept 4, 2009 9:32:13 GMT -5
Most of the people here have no opinion, Yep. And I think that's one of your more serious problems. I'd more excited if see some passionate debates (not flame war). Someone yell "I want elven ships" another "Strictly HISTORICAL!" Well m' Lord, like it or not you are the leader. If you are not, (alien voice) "take me to your leader". Anyway, I'm not taking "potshots" at you personally (you are too vain if you think so). I'm just doing a gentle water-testing of your project's seaworthiness. I guess it's a positive sign that when I point out the weakness of the project, you take personal offense, LOL load up the rum, matey, drink up! With a stronger liver, you can become a leader yet! Really... (think sagely) you know I've read a lot of statements like these from long time Pirates fans like yourself, others include "some fractions are useless" "some unit types are useless" "(competitive) players all bring the same few ships to tournaments" and I have to think this game has issues! It was the plural "you" not singular "you", it's your vanity at work again, but like I said, a little vanity is necessary for a leader. WK has died, you (singular this time) are the last Pirate King, take the helm! (COMPROMISE) I don't think you need compromise now, you need strength, you need action. You need someone to stand up and say "screw you weenies, I will do the whole thing myself!"
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Post by marhawkman on Sept 4, 2009 10:21:44 GMT -5
I don't quite agree that the more recent sets are not as good. It's that the ships a alot more boring... Without new types of ships there'd be less reason to have them.
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cleverpun
Master & Commander
I need more wenches / More wenches and mead
Posts: 46
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Post by cleverpun on Sept 6, 2009 17:24:15 GMT -5
I suppose the reason I signed up was to have a bit of fun designing a set. Not good enough? I also want to establish some pieces that break the current nations out of their stereotypical strengths. America for big guns, Spain for gold, etc. etc... Some of the fleets over at MT have shown that every nation can be played many ways, and I want to help the game become more versatile.
I also want a loch ness monster piece, as part of a Scottish sub-faction or otherwise.
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